1x19: Honour and Obey (Airdate: July 20th)

[Emcee]

On the anniversary of the Nyazian Massacre, Salome must accept her destiny by telling Connor the terrible secret she's hidden for ten years.

[bvfan Randy Giles]

Great ep i was thinking that Az and Sal were connected by Cyvus but i was thinking he was Sal's father since i didn't recall anything about her father but the whole them getting married was a nice twist and we did find out why Cyvus was worried about her.I am even more shocked that Oni was not told about the new part that they translated.

[Emcee]

I am even more shocked that Oni was not told about the new part that they translated.

Oni did know. But having all three confront Connor would have been ganging up on him.

[Wind Fish]

I know way back when I toyed with the idea that Salome and Azriel were married, but I don't think I really I meant it and I did end up backing off of it fairly quickly anyway. So I wasn't expecting that to be the case.

I wasn't very happy with Connor and his reaction though. I can understand him being angry about not being told, but by just blasting her for things she did in her past, which he knew she regretted, he lost me. But then he seemed genuinely sorry so I forgave him.

"You know, he looks like the Joker."

That was my favorite light-hearted line. And what's with Azriel breaking the Millennium Falcon? You don't break the Falcon. I'm glad he's dead, just for that.

It was nice to finally get a look into Salome's past. So unless I'm missing something, nothing that happened to her clan was her fault. She didn't make the greatest choices, but I'm not seeing a way she could have stopped anything. I guess things could have played out differently had she not run off with Azriel at that point, but it seemed like the rest of Nyazians were doomed no matter what Salome did.

"All the prophecy said was Connor and Salome would be joined for better or worse, till death."

I know how that's supposed to read, but with the way I like to interpret prophecies I ended up picturing The Simpsons Halloween episode where Mr. Burns' head has to be sewed to Homer's body. I hate my brain sometimes.

[Emcee]

If you recall, the first time Azriel shows up, Meerna asks Salome, "Are you in love with him?" and Salome initiately thinks she's referring to Azriel. That was my big hint to the Salome-Azriel marriage. They were actually originally going to be lovers, but I thought it worked better as a husband-father-mentor twisted thing, without sexuality mixed into it (besides, Salome was just a kid... Ew)

I wasn't happy with Connor's reactions either. But they are really IC for him, I think. He gets so easily swept up in anger. I mean hey, Angel is his father AND he was raised by Holtz. Moral superiority is not really shocking for him. But Salome can handle him, by quickly pointing out how hypocritical he is. And pretty much the SECOND Salome let the room Connor realized, "Fuck. I'm a dumbass."

When I was doing the first Azriel manip back in 1x05, I thought he looked like the Joker. I KNEW I had to have Connor say it at some point.

Azriel's just a tool. And yeah, you shouldn't break the Falcon. It's just... So wrong.

Salome's not really at fault for anything. She has "survivor's guilt". She feels she should have died with her clan. She also feels that if she hadn't left, Azriel wouldn't have gone through with his plan. Basically, because Azriel wanted to get her into a position that he could manipulate her, he was waiting until she was removed from the clan to make a move on them. But yeah, they were pretty much doomed no matter what Salome did. Azriel had already made up his mind to betray them.

There is more to Salome's past that will come out in S2. Obviously, this was only a hint to what has happened to her in the last ten years (and I think some her Los Angeles past has to come back and bite her in the ass).

*snerkle on the prophecy* That is definitely an interesting way to interpret it.

Personally, I think Andrew, Wes and Oni better decide to keep that little bit from Connor. If they do divulge it, considering how fast Connor moves he'll probably buy a ring immediately.

[Wind Fish]

Yeah, back when I mentioned the possibility of them being married or romantically involved, you reminded me of how old Salome was at the time, and that's when I backed off of it. Then I moved onto the idea that he was a father figure and figured they were related in some way. But by then I had forgotten what Meerna had said. The point is that I was all over the place, as usual.

During Connor's hissy fit I was thinking, "Stop being yourself for a second and just talk to her" so I agree that it was in character. Actually, I had been a little irritated with Salome for a while too. If I recall correctly, there was a moment a while ago where Connor agreed to tell her everything about his past. The fact that she didn't do the same had been bothering me. Partially because I felt she should have confided in him, and also because of the lack of success others have had with keeping things to themselves previously.

Thinking about Salome’s flashbacks started to make me wonder (and I think you've talked about this before) how she got into Stanford. Apparently at some point she must have gotten a high school degree or an equivalent, but... well, I guess if we never get any information about that (and it's not the most important issue) I would assume that Meerna is responsible for making her look like a more attractive student, whether that makes sense or not. Maybe I shouldn’t discredit Salome’s ability to get in on her own, but I’m having trouble picturing her achieving a place like Stanford in that small amount of time without some help.

My thinking on the marriage thing is that he better do it before his Riley existence is erased and his public records go back to him being Connor Angel the 3-year-old. Although I suppose there will be ways around that or it's simply not going to happen that way.

[Emcee]

Yeah, I was TOTALLY trying to throw you off track. And the hints were supposed to be all over the place, simply because that's the kind of relationship Azriel and Salome had. After I had finished this episode, I realized that Azriel/Salome are actually very comparable to Connor/Cordelia. I think, if Azriel had been smarter in his approach, Salome WOULD have slept with him (of course, she couldn't for the story to work). I think they had a twisted father/lover/mentor thing, where Connor/Cordelia had a mother/lover/mentor thing.

Salome's reasoning behind not telling Connor was "Connor never voluntarily told me his secrets, so that means I don't need to tell him. I'll tell him if I start having problems."

She should have told him. But, let's face it, the Buffyverse is full of hypocrites. Salome was terrified that Connor would hate her for what she did (and she was almost right). I think if she had done it sooner, their relationship wouldn't have progressed.

Oh, Salome TOTALLY used magic. I think she only went to two years of high school (after the incident in 2000) and then she went to Stanford. But she (or Meerna) used magic to pad her grades. I have no idea WHY Salome had the desire to go to Stanford, other than she had to in an effort to meet Connor. Maybe it was the pull of magic (since Oni did mention when the Hellmouth was destroyed that the mystical energy was diverted to Palo Alto). I think it's just something to have to accept and think of your own way it happened.

Well, Connor IS a Computer Science Major and the Watcher's Council has Willow... I think, should it come to it, Connor will be able to fix his records to reflect his new existence.

[Wind Fish]

The evil part of me is wondering if Salome had tried alcohol at that point, and if not, thinks that Azriel should have gotten her drunk first before he tried anything.

But seriously, I agree that Salome would have slept with him had he just let it happen. I was surprised he tried to force it like that, but he really did try to rely on his power too much over the course of the season so maybe I shouldn't have been. He was lucky he knew how to teleport a lot of the time.

I can understand Salome's reasoning, but I thought the perfect time to divulge her past to Connor was when he was doing the same. That would have been the time Connor would be most forgiving, I think. And that would have also been a nice way to establish trust both ways. But that's not how it happened so I can't say things would have worked out. And things seem to be working out okay the way they are so I guess I should just let those two go about their business.

-------

"Aunt Meerna, I know I’ve been talking about college lately, and I think I’ve made a decision. I want to go to Stanford. I like their fight song. But I don’t think they’d accept me."

"You dug yourself a little hole, but I think I know of a way to persuade them."

(Meerna disappears. Less than a minute later she reappears)

"Once I donate this to the university, Sweetie, they’ll have no choice but to take you.”

"Uh... Aunt Meerna? Where’d all that money come from?”

“First National Bank in Chicago. Don’t worry, I left plenty for everyone else,”

“Instead of robbing a bank, couldn’t you just alter my records or something?”

"Oh, that’s a much better idea. Well, I guess I better return all this cash to the vault before they notice it's missing."

-------

That’s how it happened. No one can convince me otherwise.

[Emcee]

Salome had *totally* tried Alcohol by the time she and Azriel were married. And he totally should have plied her with it.

And Salome would have slept with him, but Azriel's greatest failing is his overconfidence. Once he gets people into the situation he wants, he's willing to let all pretenses fall and act like his stupid, arrogant self. He does think his powers will get him as far as he needs. He thinks, because he's willing to use more power than the average Nyazian, that makes him the most powerful (with the exception of Cyvus Vail). But Salome is stronger than he is-- both mystically and mentally. He has always underestimated her because she is a "little girl". He also doesn't comprehend how strong Connor is, or how much he loves Salome.

It probably would have. And there have been a few ocassions where Salome has been tempted to tell Connor the truth. Like it's been right on the tip of her tongue, but she hasn't been able to get it out. Like, "I don't want there to be any secrets in our relationship, but if you know this ONE secret we might not have any relationship any longer."

Connor/Salome are pretty secure in their relationship now, with everything out. I think they'll be together for a long, long... Well, at least until the second season. *g*

*big laughs over your skit*

I actually meant that Meerna helped change Salome's records so she could get into high school as a third-year student (what is that... A junior? I don't know American high school years). I think Meerna did a slight alter on reality (only within the records, not on anyone's mind) reflecting what Salome's grades would have been if she had actually gone to school before that. So she did actually get into Stanford on her own merits (SAT scores, marks for years three and four), but there was a bit of a magical push.

[Wind Fish]

Yeah, what was I thinking? Salome didn't have to be new to alcohol in order for Azriel to get her bombed on their honeymoon. Man, I'd be a horrible villain. "What? You know what a gun is? Well, shucks. I guess I can't shoot you now. It wouldn't be a surprise."

So I would like to know why when I read your comments on Connor/Salome I immediately think, "Oh, so she's going to go evil and he's gonna have to kill her." I mean, talk about taking a completely innocent comment to an extreme, huh?

Oh see, for the skit I was picturing that Salome went and took the tests for a GED. Then she wouldn't even have had to bother with high school. But afterwards, instead of starting at a community college or something, she decides she likes Stanford for whatever reason and that's when they do the bank robbing altering. And not necessarily because she couldn't make it on her own, but just so she wouldn't have to go through the other formal crap first. But your way probably makes her seem more capable so I have no problem going with that.

[Emcee]

There are SOOO many ways that Azriel could have succeeded other than the "pin her down and attempt to have at it" that it's really embarrassing. He just has... Errr HAD... Too much confidence in his abilites and not enough in Salome. Of course, that's why he died in the end.

You thought that because you're crazy. Do you REALLY think I would make Salome evil? *grins*

Salome actually IS very smart and capable and I would like to think she got into Stanford on her own merits. She is definitely the least studious out of the Justice League, but with the right topic I think she really takes off. I think, like Oz, she might test well.

[Wind Fish]

Maybe someone should have told Azriel what B&D stands for. I mean, he never even got the "pin her down" part right...

Well, now I think you would! It's probably the power she's finally starting to use. I'm conditioned to think that it's going to be abused sooner or later. But I'm not predicting anything.

The simple fact about Salome is this: If she didn't belong at Stanford, she wouldn't be there anymore. She may not be the stereotypical book worm, but if she's there, she has the smarts. I never meant to imply that she didn't. I think you knew that, but eh, I'm saying it anyway just in case.

[Emcee]

Villains ALWAYS underestimate their victims and overestimate themselves. It's why they fail.

Hahahahaha! Well, there's one thing I can say: Salome's NOT Willow. Salome's powers are inherant to herself and something she's been aware of since birth. But you SO have no seen anything yet...

You're right. If Salome didn't belong at Stanford, she wouldn't still be there. She is very good at her subjects of choice. She's NOT Oni or Connor or Jamie, but she does have the goods. I didn't think you were implying otherwise, but sometimes I do need to remind myself that she is a smart gal.

BTW, speaking of Salome... I just got my hands on some SUPREMELY sexy Anna Paquin pictures. Look for some very nice Salome promos soon...

[Wind Fish]

I’m glad I poked around LJ before coming here because otherwise my hopes about Salome promos would have been absolutely destroyed if I had done it the other way around. More reason to look forward to season 2, right?

Oh! I’m glad I used the word ‘destroyed’ because it reminded me of something. I meant to say this earlier and then got distracted and forgot to comment. That new Salome icon you made, that’s good stuff.

[Emcee]

Well, remember, S2 isn't far away...

And I've got few new icons that I'll post up next update.